The Contrast between The Good Guys and The Bad Guys

Discussion in 'ThunderCats (2011)' started by srebak, Oct 1, 2014.

  1. srebak

    srebak Laser Beast

    I realize that i'm not very popular on this forum and will likely get a lot of guff for posting this, but i just had to post this, because it seemed like a good discussion: the contrast between the good guys and the bad guys (and i use both terms loosely since the show itself is pretty gray on both sides).

    It occurred to me this afternoon that Mumm-Ra's goal and Slithe's ambition both seem to be darker versions of those of Lion-O's:

    Lion-O wants to bring peace to the races of Third Earth and believes that Diplomacy, not force, is the key to achieving that goal. What's more, he also wants to protect his own people, but while he will fight to protect them if necessary, he won't forsake his ideals to do so and actually no longer believes the illusion that the Cats are all heroes anymore. He acknowledges the fact that his people pretty much brought their current plight on themselves, as well as the fact that the Cats, above all else, will have to change their way of life in order to prevent their current tragedy from repeating itself.

    Mumm-Ra also seems to want to bring order and stability, just on a much grander scale (the universe). However, instead of accomplishing this goal through alliances forged from mutual desires, Mumm-Ra sought to use a "Might makes right" way of doing things, meaning: whatever he wanted, he took unconditionally. He also relied, not on his "people"'s trust or loyalty to him, but on their fear of his power and strength, and their own selfish desires, which he promised to indulge should they join him. While Lion-O tries to see the best in people because he wants to build a better future for everyone, Mumm-Ra relies on the negative aspects of people's personalities because they're what allows him to manipulate people into doing his dirty work.

    Slithe clearly wants what's best for his people too; he wants the Lizards to finally get what they've been denied for years because of the Cats' quest for supremacy. However, while Lion-O believes that the best way to help his people is to repair the damage that they've done and make peace with the animals they've oppressed, Slithe seems to follow a "If they hit me, I'll hit back harder" way of thinking, believing that the only way to beat his enemies is to be worse than them in terms of ruthlessness, even if it means siding with someone who has the power to help them, but cares nothing for them. This even applies to his own treatment of his fellow Lizards, the very people he's fighting to protect in the first place: in one episode, he was willing to sacrifice three of his loyal soldiers just to kill the Cats, even though the only reason he was hunting them was to avenge the persecution of his own people. The fact of the matter is, while Lion-O refuses to sacrifice his ideals to achieve his goals, Slithe has allowed himself to become the very thing he (allegedly) was fighting against.
  2. Mark M

    Mark M Thunderian Legend

    In some ways and see what they were trying to do in theory But the writers just didn't have the ability. Instead we were left with unlikable characters and both sides and it was hard to cheer for the 'heroes'. I wish Mumm-Ra had been fleshed out a bit more to give us a better understanding of him.
  3. Thunderdork

    Thunderdork New Member

    I personally liked the fact in the 2011 series the alliance of good and bad guys were gray and not strictly black or white.
    (I don't believe ANYONE is "all" good or "all" bad for that matter. That includes mass murderers and sweet little old grandmas.)

    It made the characters so much fun to analyze
    on another note..
    Many people find it a little jarring that Slithe was supposed to be portrayed with a good side in the un-aired season but I kind of saw that coming. In Slithe's defense...

    1:(in regards to the Petlar episode, only tolerable because of the lizard action lol) many feral lizards tend to be solitary by nature, so the fact that Slithe is willing to sacrifice some of his men for the advancement of his whole army, in my theory, just reflects a common lizard mentality and not necessarily his "bad side"

    2: (In regards the Trials of Lion-O episodes) Slithe has shown a chivalrous side; he didn't want to harm the Kit (at least not himself) which indicated to me Slithe does value life to some degree; even if its children/ females

    (and if you want to talk unpopular)

    I'll take some of the burden off of you and confess a crazy fan theory about Slithe (I'm allowed to have these because season II is't going to happen *sniffles*

    Slithe IS a female; the eggs that were lost when Lynx-O's troops burned his village or however it went, she laid herself and in her rage she assumed the role of a male in order to rally the other lizard males to join Mumm-Ra (like a viviporious lizard assuming the role of a male in mating season)

    stew on that Thundera lol...
  4. Mark M

    Mark M Thunderian Legend

    I don't know about that. I think I read somewhere that it was his wife and children that were killed but I suppose your theory is plausible.
    It isn't the craziest thing I have heard people say about the NS....
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2014
  5. Thunderdork

    Thunderdork New Member

    You're right actually, they did state it was his wife and hatchlings that burned

    I should have called fan idea as opposed to fan theory a theory now that I think about it
  6. srebak

    srebak Laser Beast

    That's probably because Slithe's character didn't exactly scream "tortured soul" as much as it did "vicious, warmongering General who'd look for any reason to kill the Cats". I myself had plans for a story line where Slithe is either on the run from the Cats and the other animals for his War crimes or is actually placed in prison for said crimes

    I'll give you the first one, but i think the second was more of Slithe being sadistically ironic and preferring to let Addicus do his dirty work for him. His words and facial expression didn't exactly scream "someone who holds life with value", at least not to me
  7. Mark M

    Mark M Thunderian Legend

    They show should have had more female mutants.
    Merged Post:
    I sometimes get side tracked and blame the writers instead of discussing the characters but on this point Srebak I do agree with you.
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2014
  8. Thunderdork

    Thunderdork New Member

  9. NuudoruNoMasho

    NuudoruNoMasho Berbill

    I was under the impression that all our bad guys were gonna be used as "Character Mirrors" rather than letting them have much character themselves. Made me nervous when that was starting to be implied with Vultare and Tygra. Gotta be careful with that sort of Plot technique. It can make characters feel very shallow when handled haphazardly. When handled with finesse it has a lovely simplicity and can still maintain depth.

    Mad minds think similarly I suppose. As a private joke to.... myself. I Imagine Vulturman/Vultare is Broad because of a Mythological and Historical Monomorphism based fallacy...Only because it makes me laugh. I'd have loved there been a bit more zoology based factors in play.
  10. balgus82

    balgus82 Thunderian Legend

    I remember asking the crew's tumblr once how, if an evil person can't touch the Sword, Grune could. They never directly said it, but they hinted that if the rules were that the sword can't touch someone that's pure evil then Grune (and by extention the other baddies that touched it) aren't pure evil. Though Mumm-Ra, of course, was.

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